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Math question: What's 15 x 0 ?

""Some people will have you believe that the primary impact of spyware is the spying on your systems, but that is the secondary impact of spyware," Garms said during his talk. Crashes, reboots and poor performance "are the things that generate user help desk calls."" I guess that depends on whether you run a help desk or if you're a user that lost personal information to a spyware program. Another example of how Microsoft is out of touch with the actual concerns of their users.

More Maths - 2% of market == loud + irrational?

Amiga = 15 x 0

"Math question: What's 15 x 0 ?" the number of people who use macs?

"I guess that depends on whether you run a help desk or if you're a user that lost personal information to a spyware program" Spyware is unlikely to cause the loss of personal information - remember, this software is spying, not stealing. It would only be reasonable to state that data loss would occur through system instability - which, is kind of inline with Microsoft's position on this.

Now now, don't be mad because there are no spyware on a mac.

"remember, this software is spying, not stealing" Oh, that's rich. Spyware only LOOKS, it doesn't TOUCH. Talk about your reality distortion fields... Educate yourself, dimwit. Type "define:Spyware" into Google: Programs that, when installed on your computer, change settings, display advertising, and/or track Internet behavior and report information back to a central database. Spyware sometimes installed unintentionally by users along with other wanted software, and can be very hard to remove. Also known as malware. http://www.techlearning.com/content/outlook/itguy/2003/6-26.html Strictly defined, spyware consists of computer software that gathers and reports information about a computer user without the user's knowledge or consent. More broadly, the term spyware can refer to a wide range of related malware products which fall outside the strict definition of spyware. These products perform many different functions, including the delivery of unrequested advertising (pop-up ads in particular), harvesting private information, re-routing page requests to illegally ... en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spyware Secret code hidden in an otherwise harmless program. Spyware permits unauthorized access to a computer, allowing someone else to observe the user, read data, or even control the computer. Open source is transparent, so it's nearly impossible to hide spyware. www.netc.org/openoptions/appendices/glossary.html

"Spyware is unlikely to cause the loss of personal information" I meant "lost personal information" in the sense that it can be stolen through a spyware program. I can see how you got confused; I probably wasn't clear enough.

"Now now, don't be mad because there are no spyware on a mac." I'm kinda feeling left out. I may just buy a Windows PC so I can see what this "spyware" and "malware" and "virus" buzz is all about. I'd like to experience downtime and lost productivity, too...then I can get time off because "my computer is down" just like the j a c k a s s e s in the cubicles next to me.

What's spyware? Oh, yeah, it's that Windows thing. M$ kidz only defend Windows because they've put so much time and money into it that they can't turn back now. Have fun fixing your "registry" and paying for firewalls and anti-virus software, as you buy a 3Ghz PC just to let Longhorn display window contents on the screen. Suckers. ROFL "OS X is simply better than Windows. Especially for power users." - Paul Thurrott, Windows tech writer

What's "spyware?" What's "crashing?" Oh, that's right, I use a Mac. I forgot Windows users are too busy fixing stuff to get any work done. Windows--for playing videogames. Like the Sims. Macs--for getting real work done.

Tick tock tick tock Two more years of Windows XP! Have fun waiting another two years to get the basic security and feature set Mac users already enjoy today. Lol. By then, the next OS X will be out for Microsoft to feverishly copy

Windows kidz are obsessed with justifying an defending M$ Windows, because they've put so much wasted time and effort into keeping the sinking ship running that they take it personally when you point out that Macs just work, period. For god's sakes, you guys still use a "registry" and run with admin privileges in the year 2005. No wonder you guys get rooted every month and have a "Patch Tuesday." "OS X is simply better than Windows." - Paul Thurrott

I searched Spotlight for the term "spyware" and didn't come up with anything on my iBook. Can a Windows user please inform a Mac user like me what this mysterious software is? I hear it's all the rage in the PC world, and that all the Windows users have it. I'm feeling left out.

What is this "spyware" thing you guys are talking about? As a Mac user for five years, I've never encountered this "spyware" or "virus" thing. Could a kind Windows user let me in on the secret? I did a Spotlight search but didn't come up with anything on my PowerMac G5 (same kind of computer Microsoft used to power its X-Box 360 demos at E3). Thanks.

I looked up the definition of "spyware," but since this appears to be something that affects only the Windows-using world, shouldn't the definition be changed to specifically mention Windows instead of the generic "your computer?" After all, OS X has never had a single trojan, spyware, or virus in its existence. And it sure as hell never had MS.Blaster, which rebooted 2/3rds of the computers in the world. Have fun waiting another TWO WHOLE YEARS, suckers.

okay, i've been doing advanced spotlight queries using Finder, and i can't come up with a single instance of this "spyware" thing you windows users are talking about. i'm beginning to think it doesn't exist, or is some sort of in-joke. did i figure it out? i'll keep looking to see if i can find this "spyware" thing on my mac, but so far, nothing's come up, and versiontracker shows nothing for macs. in fact, there apparently is no spyware for the mac WHATSOEVER i guess i'll have to fire up a windows PC sometime and find out what this "spyware" thing is all about

OK, I tried running IE on my Mac for a while to see if I could pick up any of this "spyware" stuff you Windows users keep talking about all the time. But nothing happened. Do I need to go find a Windows PC to find out what this "spyware" and "virus" hub-bub is all about?

Spotlight isn't returning anything on this "spyware" stuff. What is it? I guess as a Mac user, I've never encountered it.

Hey, guys, another OS X user here wondering what the heck "spyware" is. I'm doing a search on Acquisition now to see if I can come up with anything. Apparently, "spyware" is the most-used software in the Windows world, but I can't seem to find any OS X ports. Could it be OS X simply isn't designed for "spyware" the way Windows is?

My parents call me all the time to fix their "spyware" stuff on Windows, so I feel kind of left out when it never, ever occurs on my five Macs all connected to the 'net. I don't even need a firewall because OS X doesn't keep a bunch of pointless ports open the way Windows does. Poor Windows kidz. Living ten years behind everyone else in the computing world. You guys don't even have hardware-accelerated windowing yet.

Hell, you guys are searching for "spyware," but I'm searching for "virus." It doesn't seem that there's an OS X port of "virus" out either. Must be one of those Windows-exclusive games that all the kids play.

Windows kidz don't want to admit the problems with their OS because they've invested too much time and money into keeping it running. Windows takes a lot of work to keep running smoothly, and often you have to give up and do a clean reinstall every six months just to fix random problems. It must be weird being a Windows user, who simply accepts the idea of randomly reinstalling EVERYTHING ALL OVER AGAIN just to fix problems. I've done an Archive and Install setup since OS X 10.2 on my iBook and never, ever done a reinstall. For you Windows kidz, OS X lets you do "Archive and Install" which automatically backs up your system folder, installs the OS clean, and copies your settings back. That's right, kidz, OS X even backs up your system for you. You guys are eleven years behind, LOL!

Microsoft Windows--leading the world in distributed computing by being the #1 purveyor of spyware crap, trojans, viruses, worms, and other hellholes. Have fun when another two-thirds of the world has their computers rebooting again, morons. ROFLMAO

it must suck for M$ kidz to see that Apple's stock price has been about $10 higher than M$ for a long time now

It's amazing, the abuse Windows users will subject themselves to and then justify. Random reinstalling? Spending late nights fixing registries? Buying anti-virus and firewall programs? Cleaning spyware and trojans? Running in admin privileges in the year 2005? No hardware-accelerated graphics? No drag-and-drop install? No efficiently designed human interface so you don't get a headache using it all day at work? No wonder Microsoft is dying on all fronts, while Apple's marketshare is doubling this year and tripling the next according to all analysts.

Hey, guys, Spotlight isn't returning any results for "spyware." What is it? Another Windows-only computer game or something?

Windows XP SP2 is a great building block for security. Of course, if you install every Active X control that comes with the p*o*r*n movies then nothing can help you. But if you *do* want a relatively secure system, with a little tweaking, you can do it with Windows XP SP2. You just have to use your head a bit, which should be the case if you are involved in computing anyway. My opinion: Before connecting a system running Windows XP to the Internet for the first time, you should have already boosted your Internet Explorer's security levels, especially the Internet security zone. The default is too low. Limit scripting to simple scripting only if you decide to permit scripting in that zone at all. Also in Advanced, Install on demand should be completely off. You shouldn't need it to do downloads. Any site that needs more should be refused unless it is a reputable one. If so, add it to your Trusted Zone. Which by the way itself should be boosted to at least Medium level. Alos make sure File and Print Sharing and Client for Microsoft Networks is not bound to the device connecting [modem, network interface card] to the Internet. Many suggest using a router w. firewall to do the connection to the Internet - your call. Firefox ?? It's riddled with security holes - it's already on its third or fourth release they've had to do so much fixing - so don't bother with it. It is just another way for them to get onto your system. Turn ON automatic updating! Optionally, you might check out the services running on your PC to tighten those a bit too. Read up before doing anything though. But most of all it's habits of the user. Don't be opening everything and especially do not agree to Active X controls being installed. Don't download screensavers and don't install any offerings. Use software only from reputable sources. But all that's pretty much common sense anyway regardless of the computer platform and regardless of the operating system.

"Hey, guys, Spotlight isn't returning any results for "spyware." What is it? Another Windows-only computer game or something? " Spyware is something you get when you have more than 10 users using an OS.

Firefox ?? It's riddled with security holes - it's already on its third or fourth release they've had to do so much fixing - so don't bother with it. It is just another way for them to get onto your system. Rich comment. NO system is entirely secure. Even the dimwit who said that the Mac has never had a virus. Not true. They have had to do a lot more fixing with IE, I can tell you that much. With IE you are very wide open to problems, even with SP2. Firefox may be on it's fourth release (if you really want to call it that, since they are updates), but the borage of updates that I get on a monthly basis related to IE is scary. Enter IE7. If we are talking about the user experience, then spyware does impart that more than anything else. Microsoft is correct in telling it this way. Random prolbems with your machine, the need to reboot, popups, slowness all affect the user experience, and therefore are a big concern. These user experience issues also translate to more support calls. Now on to Apple. Security through obscurity never lasted long. If Apple does ever gain some reasonable market share, you will start seeing more viruses and spyware. It is all a matter of the economics (time-benefit analysis). Spwyare "purveyors" don't bother programming something for that shiny machine called the Mac since it has, what, 2-4% market share? 90+% sounds like a better target if you ask me. By the way, for your searchlight, spotlight, whatever you call it users. I typed in to Google "mac users intelligence" and got about 1.4 million hits. When I typed in "windows users intelligence", I got about 6.5 million hits. Coincidence?

""Spyware is something you get when you have more than 10 users using an OS." No, it's something you get when the security of your OS sucks ***. Saying security disappears when there's more users isn't true, because the Apache webserver is the most-used server on the 'net, and yet it's IIS that has more exploits. Hear that? It's the sound of your argument disappearing. Next. Macs have millions of users around the world, from universities to NASA to Pixar to the entire media content industry to a burgeoning home market. Windows has millions of warezing gamers who have no idea what "admin privileges" even means and think it's normal to have to "fix a registry" or do a "clean install" every couple of weeks. Go back to your iBox, er, X-Box 360 based on Apple hardware. ROFL

"Spyware is something you get when you have more than 10 users using an OS." my FAVORITE part of the Windows kidz mindset is that the only thing they can defend their crappy OS with is that it has a bigger market share. LOL, don't you realize how silly you look when that's all you've got? It's an admission of defeat. "Oh, yeah? Well Windows is used by more people thanks to Microsoft's illegal OEM deals of the 90s! TAKE THAT!!" Hahaha... Britney Spears sells more CDs than Mozart. So what? People are sheep. Like you, for instance. Have fun waiting another two years to get the basic feature set OS X has had since 2002. ROFLMAO!

Hmm, let's check out Secunia, shall we? Quote: because the Apache webserver is the most-used server on the 'net, and yet it's IIS that has more exploits. IIS 6, 3 advisories: http://secunia.com/product/1438/ Apache 2.0x, 24 advisories: http://secunia.com/product/73/ Even IIS 5, 11 advisories: http://secunia.com/product/39/ Next...

"Now on to Apple. Security through obscurity never lasted long. If Apple does ever gain some reasonable market share, you will start seeing more viruses and spyware." No you won't. Prove it. "It is all a matter of the economics (time-benefit analysis). Spwyare "purveyors" don't bother programming something for that shiny machine called the Mac since it has, what, 2-4% market share? 90+% sounds like a better target if you ask me." No, it's because OS X is based on a BSD security model that disallows such spyware attacks. For instance, OS X doesn't ship with a hundred random Internet ports open for no reason the way Windows XP does, requiring a firewall to guard them all. OS X has a firewall but it's not even turned on! It's not needed because no ports are open. Microsoft thinks Windows Update even needs to have its own port. Didn't it make you pause when two-thirds of the entire world had their computers start rebooting over and over thanks to MS.Blaster? Didn't it make you pause when the army got hacked using Windows NT and so now run OS X for army.mil? It's hard to argue with hard data and actual real-world examples. "By the way, for your searchlight, spotlight, whatever you call it users. I typed in to Google "mac users intelligence" and got about 1.4 million hits. When I typed in "windows users intelligence", I got about 6.5 million hits. Coincidence?" Typing "windows spyware" gets about 10 million more hits than "mac spyware" does. Coincidence? Have fun waiting another two years to get basic desktop search features that OS X already has right now. LOL. Shouldn't you be off fixing your registry with admin privileges on the next "Patch Tuesday?"

My favorite thing in the world is Windows users trying to lecture others on security. I guarantee 100% of you are running with full administrator privileges and have Windows Update running religiously every week, Norton sucking up resources on your "system tray," ZoneAlarm also sucking up resources, and Lavasoft Ad-aware sitting around for your weekly spyware purge. Do you even know what a limited-user account is, and how OS X doesn't run as root like Windows does? Do you know what it means to not ship with any open ports in the year 2005? Do you know what basic security is, and how OS X asks for a password before an app can install itself? Or is your PC too busy rebooting thanks to the latest RPC exploit? Windows users, always behind the curve. Yeah, let's hear what the Windows users have to say about security. HAHAHAHAHA!!

Why don't you mac users check inside of dashboard, you've looked everywhere else.

"Why don't you mac users check inside of dashboard, you've looked everywhere else." Just checked. Nope, no spyware there either; nothing but a nice set of gorgeous widgets giving me info. Can you Windows users let us know what this "spyware" thing is? Apparently, you guys know ALL about it. Hell, what am I saying, you don't even have a Dashboard equivalent or a Spotlight equivalent. And you won't for another two years, and even then it will be crippled. Heheh. Have fun rebooting and fixing your registries, running Spybot and Ad-aware every few days for another two years. When Longhorn comes out, expect even more major exploits of all those new APIs. should be fun

"Why don't you mac users check inside of dashboard, you've looked everywhere else." How about I root your Windows machine and just check yours?

Quote: No you won't. Prove it. Sorry, can't prove it. We won't ever know what a Mac that has a big market share will ever be like. Quote: OS X has a firewall but it's not even turned on! You're serious about this one? So you are saying that running something that is beneficial to working on the Internet, that is not automatically on is a good thing? Hmm, you know. I have a car with 8 air bags, and I've never been in an accident. So by your logic, I don't have to wear a setbelt then, do I? You know, it is actually pretty easy to avoid viruses and spyware. I am an experienced user, and throughout my entire computing experience I have never gotten any viruses, or any non-cookie related spyware on my machine. Common sense computing.

It's funny how you mac fanatics comment on what Microsoft does wrong, and then on how apple does that same thing right. It's most feasable that apple learned from Microsoft's mistakes, and rectified them. So, it only follows that the mac wouldn't be what it is today, if it wasn't for Microsoft making all the mistakes. Apple feeds of the shortcomings of Microsoft. Much like a leach feeds off an animal that is ignorant of the leach's existance.

From the following link: "I was a PC bigot. Then I got mad as hell and switched to Mac." http://www.networkworld.com/columnists/2005/052305schwartau.html

Heh, from that linked article: "In the coming weeks I'm going to keep a diary of an experiment my company began at 6 p.m. April 29, 2005 - an experiment predicated on the hypothesis that the WinTel platform represents the greatest violation of the basic tenets of information security and has become a national economic security risk. I do not say this lightly, and I have never been a Microsoft basher, either. I never criticize a company without a fair bit of explanation, justification and supportive evidence."

"It's funny how you mac fanatics comment on what Microsoft does wrong, and then on how apple does that same thing right." Uh, what exactly are you talking about? "It's most feasable that apple learned from Microsoft's mistakes, and rectified them." No, Apple was smart from the beginning and understood basic UNIX security principles of having a non-root user. "So, it only follows that the mac wouldn't be what it is today, if it wasn't for Microsoft making all the mistakes. Apple feeds of the shortcomings of Microsoft. Much like a leach feeds off an animal that is ignorant of the leach's existance." Wow. Look at the sad depths that Windows kidz have sunk too. Now it's a GOOD thing that Microsoft made a bunch of mistakes, because it made Macs better?! ROFLMAO...geez, you're not even praising Microsoft in that statement. Shouldn't you be off fixing your registry and running Ad-aware? Check out what server army.mil uses sometime. It used to use Windows NT. Then it got hacked.

"Quote: No you won't. Prove it. Sorry, can't prove it. We won't ever know what a Mac that has a big market share will ever be like." Once again, all Windows kidz have is "market share." Britney Spears sells more CDs than Mozart. Microsoft is a convicted monopolist. What's your point? What does that have to do with the merits of the OS? Macs are the one who were rebooting in two-thirds of the world thanks to MS.Blaster. "Quote: OS X has a firewall but it's not even turned on! You're serious about this one? So you are saying that running something that is beneficial to working on the Internet, that is not automatically on is a good thing? Hmm, you know. I have a car with 8 air bags, and I've never been in an accident. So by your logic, I don't have to wear a setbelt then, do I?" Once again, Windows kidz illustrate their lack of knowledge about security. What part of, "OS X doesn't ship with any open ports" don't you get? Windows has taught people that firewalls are necessary for some reason. All firewalls do is guard open ports. OS X ships with no open ports. A firewall would be 100% pointless. Nonetheless, you can turn it on with the click of a checkbox. Firewalls aren't beneficial on OS X--they're completely unnecessary, as there aren't any ports turned on. LOL "You know, it is actually pretty easy to avoid viruses and spyware. I am an experienced user, and throughout my entire computing experience I have never gotten any viruses, or any non-cookie related spyware on my machine. Common sense computing." You were forced to waste your time learning that the hard way thanks to Windows. You still run in admin privileges and have to run Ad-aware constantly. A decade of crappy Windows experiences has taught you to walk a tightrope in order to not get infected. OS X lets you just hurry up and get your work done. To quote Paul Thurrot himself: "OS X is simply better than Windows. Especially for power users."

Windows is complex, trying to be everything to everyone. This complexity comes at a terrible price: downtime, help desks, upgrades, patches and the inevitable failures. When a new operating system or service pack is released, there are tons of changes to the functionality. WinTel machines use different versions of BIOS. They are not all equal, nor do they all have the same level of compatibility. Some Windows software applications are well written; others take shortcuts. Shortcuts may work in some environments, but not all, and ultimately the consumer pays in lost time, availability and productivity. Hardware. There are hundreds of "WinTel-compatible" motherboards, each claiming to be better than the next. Whatever. Memory. Not all RAM is equal. Some works well. Cheap stuff doesn't. Hard disks. Same problem: cheap or reliable. Your call.

Spotlight doesn't return any results for "spyware." Is this a Windows-only videogame or something? I hear it's the most-used software on the Win32 platform. I guess as Mac user, I'm too busy GETTING THINGS DONE than worrying about "viruses," "trojans," "spyware," "Patch Tuesday," "registries," and all the other ENDLESS CRAP Windows is chock-full of and subjecting its users to. Even Microsoft used Apple PowerMacs to power its E3 demos.

I love it. Windows users trying to "educate" about security. Did someone here actually criticize OS X for not having a firewall on by default? LOL. What would be the point of that since OS X has no open ports to the Internet? This isn't Windows, where an RPC exploit can take out over half the Earth's computers, or where the messenger service was on and used to spam everyone for years.

SP2 makes XP 15 times more secure, making it 40% as secure as OS X. I laughed and laughed when all the computers around me were rebooting due to MS.Blaster. My Powerbook just kept chugging along. Immediately after, my whole company switched to Mac and avoided all the worms that have come out since.

The WinTel platform is simply not stable and reliable. Even friggin' hyperthreading now has an exploit available. Why do you guys think even Microsoft chose to go with custom hardware based on PowerPC for their new "digital hub" X-Box 360 computing platform? Even Microsoft knows PCs suck. Read the writing on the wall.

If your assumption that I am a "Microsoft Kid" is correct, then it would be deep and not sad that I made that comment. I realize the mistakes that Microsoft has made, and accept them, mistakes are what make us human. It is sad how you get on a site and slam a operating system, talk up another operating system, only pointing out the good stuff they have done. That seems pretty shallow to me. But I don't have any degrees, haven’t studied logic, and don't spend my free time analyzing the rhetoric that this world displays. Your right, I am a dumb windows user who can't see beyond my nose.

"If your assumption that I am a "Microsoft Kid" is correct, then it would be deep and not sad that I made that comment. I realize the mistakes that Microsoft has made, and accept them, mistakes are what make us human." Microsoft only got in its position through illegal monopoly bullying, illegal OEM deals, and so on. OS/2 was superior when Windows 3.1 came out. Now we see the results of a company with crappy technical ability who only got popular through illegal bullying and not OS quality. They're trying to graft security onto an aging codebase. Users now think firewalls, anti-spyware scanners, and anti-virus software are normal features of an operating system. All because of crappy Windows security. "It is sad how you get on a site and slam a operating system, talk up another operating system, only pointing out the good stuff they have done." It's not sad; it's informative. If there is a superior technical solution, users should know about it, or else we'll continue to live in the five-year-behind world of computing that Windows has put out. Non-Windows computing has advanced at least seven years in the field, from security to interface design to APIs (Cocoa kicks the butt of WinFX and .NET). "That seems pretty shallow to me. But I don't have any degrees, haven’t studied logic, and don't spend my free time analyzing the rhetoric that this world displays. Your right, I am a dumb windows user who can't see beyond my nose." If I can convince just one user like you, my work is done. Now, onto the next Windows kid.

My brother came down to visit from college this summer. He brought his Compaq. Immediately after he uninstalled an app, he ran this thing called "Crap Cleaner." He did it quickly and without question, as though it was a religious routine. He was surprised when I started laughing. I had forgotten just how bad Windows was, with its registry entries, files littering the hard drive everywhere, temp files, and so on. The Mac version of the same software just lets me drag the app to the Trash can to delete it.

what did you convince me of?

I forgot, if you are shallow you probably don't recognize sarcasm.

"I forgot, if you are shallow you probably don't recognize sarcasm." Actually, it seems that it is you who doesn't recognize it. Go out and buy a Powerbook. You'll thank me for it.

The problem with no human interaction is the fact that you can't read tones or the body. However, there is an obvious way to imply sarcasm in the computer world. And you do not have those skills.

"Go out and buy a Powerbook. You'll thank me for it." We just got rid of our last Mac, and celebrated with a bottle of champagne

Intel CEO reccomends Macs for Security. Ouch.

"The problem with no human interaction is the fact that you can't read tones or the body. However, there is an obvious way to imply sarcasm in the computer world. And you do not have those skills." The skills of detecting sarcasm requires a certain level of intelligence that Windows kidz lack. "We just got rid of our last Mac, and celebrated with a bottle of champagne" I know, I watched from your new rooted Windows box.

"Intel CEO reccomends Macs for Security. Ouch." ROFL Here you go, kidz: http://tinyurl.com/b8wu7 It just gets worse and worse for you guys.

"I know, I watched from your new rooted Windows box." Some of my comments are not sound, I will admit, but that was just plane stupid.

plain sorry

"Windows kidz are obsessed with justifying..blah blah.." Um, Windows chaps are actually defending themselves, because in your own words "kidz", indicating you're attacking a PERSON. Do you have a sense of the futility of the shite you spout online? Do you think it makes your **** grow because you're attacking someone based on the Computer Operating System they use? Have some sense of perspective - you're wasting your life - Macs have tiny market share because that's the number of people who find the infernal machines useful - but it's no point being ****** off and whining over "monopoly this and that" simply because the huge installed base of PC users perfer less than solid stability in exchange for being able to build their machines fantastically cheaper, more customised, with a software library an order of magnitude larger. You're just plain nuts. I like my PC because it runs the stuff I need. You like your Mac for the same reason, or perhaps just because you're a **** in need of a cause. Whoops. I did it too!

"Have some sense of perspective - you're wasting your life - Macs have tiny market share because that's the number of people who find the infernal machines useful" Like NASA, the military, universities, Pixar, the entire media content industry, the entire film industry, the entire music industry, millions of home users, etc. "but it's no point being ****** off and whining over "monopoly this and that" simply because the huge installed base of PC users perfer less than solid stability in exchange for being able to build their machines fantastically cheaper, more customised, with a software library an order of magnitude larger." So, in other words, quantity over quality? "You're just plain nuts. I like my PC because it runs the stuff I need. You like your Mac for the same reason, or perhaps just because you're a **** in need of a cause. Whoops. I did it too!"" Shouldn't you be off switching to Mac BECAUSE INTEL'S OWN CEO ADMITS YOU SHOULD BUY A MAC FOR SECURITY? ROFLMAO!!!

"my FAVORITE part of the Windows kidz mindset is that the only thing they can defend their crappy OS with is that it has a bigger market share. LOL, don't you realize how silly you look when that's all you've got? It's an admission of defeat. "Oh, yeah? Well Windows is used by more people thanks to Microsoft's illegal OEM deals of the 90s! TAKE THAT!!" Hahaha... " That's pretty much the only defence you need when you are talking about security. Look at FireFox, people thought it was so incredibly secure but now that it is being used more that is not that case anymore. Do you honestly think the @pple engineers know more about security then Microsoft engineers? It's no different then replacing @pple with Amiga. "Britney Spears sells more CDs than Mozart. So what? People are sheep. Like you, for instance. Have fun waiting another two years to get the basic feature set OS X has had since 2002. ROFLMAO! " I believe Mozarts music has sold more than Britney Spears. He has been around much longer. Stupid argument.

Haha...the Windows kidz admit that Micro$oft has an illegal monopoly, prefers quantity over quality, and admits Micro$oft's security sucks compared to Apple. Now Intel's CEO even agrees with you. As does Paul Thurrott, who said "OS X is simply better than Windows. Especially for power users." hahaha...have fun next "Patch Tuesday" running in admin privileges while scanning your registry endlessly with Ad-aware

Let's sum it up: Macs have no spyware, no viruses, no trojans, and no worms. Microsoft's security sucks compared to them, and it's all about quantity over quality. In addition, Paul Thurrott and Intel's own CEO recommend Macs, and Microsoft is using PowerPCs in the next X-Box and running Powermac G5s for their dev kits. Why are you guys still running Windows again? Oh, right, sheep afraid of change even when it's better.

"That's pretty much the only defence you need when you are talking about security. Look at FireFox, people thought it was so incredibly secure but now that it is being used more that is not that case anymore." Thank goodness there's Safari, the only known browser to pass the Acid2 test. "Do you honestly think the @pple engineers know more about security then Microsoft engineers?" Yes, they do. OS X is designed on UNIX foundations, the most secure OS in the world. Why do you think the military switched army.mil from Windows NT to OS X after they got hacked? "I believe Mozarts music has sold more than Britney Spears. He has been around much longer. Stupid argument." You "believe" incorrectly. Britney Spears sells more CDs than Mozart every year. Wow, lame arguments all around. Next.

HAHAHAHA--Intel CEO admits Macs are more secure! Says he spends hours every week removing spyware from daughter's computer! HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA... It gets worse and worse for you guys...

Yawn .. Apple is security by obscurity. So's Linux. The only OS fighting the fight is Windows and it is slowly and surely being hardened. Now if they could only wisen up the users .. Here's an example. Many Windows users find themselves with a dialogue box such as this: Hi I'm your p*o*r*n video and I want you to install ActiveX components so I will let you play me. Do you want to download and install my SuperHot XXX Software? [Yes] [No] What do you think many the response of many Windows users will be? Right, and that is the problem. But you would find this problem on any platform that became popular as long as oictures of Pamela Anderson are out there. Apple and Linux are secure through obscurity, not because they've been tested, tried. So, Apple user, now that I've had to explain the answer to you why are you still here? Isn't your platform interesting enough or do you secretly admire the ease-of use, the security [if you want it], wide range of software and hardware - on the fastest processors - that Windows users enjoy?

"You "believe" incorrectly. Britney Spears sells more CDs than Mozart every year. " I'm talking about overall. Amiga sells less than @pple. So Amiga is better?

Yes, yes. You Mac Users are right. I was so wrong. Please forgive me for this terrible mistake. Now can I go back and do some work?

Microsoft: SP2 Makes XP 15 Times More Secure. thats such a bad headline. Makes me think of those people that bought Xp and haven't upgrade to SP2 and are 15 times more likely to get screwed....

RE: "Apple is security by obscurity." WRONG!! 15+ MILLION OS X installs. 0 (ZERO) viruses. RE: "Here's an example. Many Windows users find themselves with a dialogue box such as this: Hi I'm your p*o*r*n video and I want you to install ActiveX components so I will let you play me. Do you want to download and install my SuperHot XXX Software? [Yes] [No] What do you think many the response of many Windows users will be? Right, and that is the problem. But you would find this problem on any platform that became popular as long as oictures of Pamela Anderson are out there. " WRONG!!!!! There's NO ACTIVE X mess on Mac OS X and clicking a dialog box in Safari does NOT authorize ANY code to install/execute. One of HUNDREDS of examples why Windows is a joke. Even as an "Admin" user on my Mac, there's NO WAY I'm allowed to write or modify any files in the System directory. That's why my OS X install is as clean & fast two years later as the day I got it.

Why do Mac users post here? This is a Windows site. Mac users please stay in your playpen. You are wasting everyone's time here. No one cares about your idiot rants. Apple doesn't care about you. They are a large, evil, greedy corporation just like Microsoft.

MAC users are so sad - they feel this need to prove their supremacy all the time, with "LOLS" liberally peppered all over the place as if they've said something funny. Which they haven't. The only thing they've said that is funny is that MACs are better than Windows PCs. All this guffawing and poking fun at windows is just penis envy. Grow up, MAC kiddiez!

A generous estimate says there are 15 million installs of the Mac OS .. wow There are 70 million computers running Windows in India alone. Apple = security by obscurity.

"Yawn .. Apple is security by obscurity. So's Linux. The only OS fighting the fight is Windows and it is slowly and surely being hardened. Now if they could only wisen up the users .. Here's an example. Many Windows users find themselves with a dialogue box such as this: Hi I'm your p*o*r*n video and I want you to install ActiveX components so I will let you play me. Do you want to download and install my SuperHot XXX Software? [Yes] [No] What do you think many the response of many Windows users will be? Right, and that is the problem. But you would find this problem on any platform that became popular as long as oictures of Pamela Anderson are out there. Apple and Linux are secure through obscurity, not because they've been tested, tried." Uh, no you wouldn't. Linux and Mac aren't stupid enough to include an "ActiveX" platform accessible to the wilds of the web. ActiveX has been the cause of more security exploits than almost anything. So, yeah, nice example there. LOL

Instead of responding to the Windows kidz who are in denial, I'll merely quote your hero Paul Thurrott: "OS X is simply better than Windows. Especially for power users." Next.

"I'm talking about overall." Overall, Britney Spears sells more CDs than Mozart. You just can't get around this point, can you? "Amiga sells less than @pple. So Amiga is better?" Who said the least-selling is better? You want to draw absolutes from everything, apparently. The point is that Windows isn't better simply because it has big market share. Another Windows kid reveals his lack of logic. TWO MORE YEARS of Windows XP, woohoo!

AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!! Did I really read a Windows user lecturing about security and using ActiveX as an example? *takes breath* AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!! No wonder your M$ company is going down the tubes, being taken over by Apple and Google.

So far, no Windows user has addressed the registry, spyware, and other arguments that have been put forth. I guess they've simply accepted that Windows does indeed suck ***. "Why do Mac users post here? This is a Windows site. Mac users please stay in your playpen. You are wasting everyone's time here. No one cares about your idiot rants. Apple doesn't care about you. They are a large, evil, greedy corporation just like Microsoft." "OS X is simply better than Windows." - Paul Thurrot. ROFL!

"A generous estimate says there are 15 million installs of the Mac OS .. wow There are 70 million computers running Windows in India alone." After all, quantity over quality, right? Britney Spears sells more CDs than Mozart, too. "Apple = security by obscurity." No, security through common sense. Here are some questions for you to answer, but I know you won't because you can't admit it: Windows has you running in admin accounts. OS X doesn't. Windows writes into a "registry" that often gets corrupted. OS X has no registry. Windows leaves so many random ports open to the net that it had to ship with a default firewall. OS X doesn't have any ports open. Those 70 million users in India got to have their 70 million computers reboot constantly thanks to MS.Blaster. OS X did not. Windows has open platforms like ActiveX that allow websites to do almost anything they want, spreading worms and viruses like the plague. OS X does not. I could go on and on and on and on....... Clearly, I've proven that Microsoft's lack of security has more to do with its boneheaded design decisions. UNIX is the most-used and widely tested operating system in the world, and you don't see it rooted all the time. Instead, it just keeps chugging along, running most of the Internet. The army switched army.mil to OS X after it got hacked using Windows NT. They haven't been hacked since. Case closed. You = owned. Next.

"There are 70 million computers running Windows in India alone." Running cash registers and ATMs, lol. All 70 million of them had the fun of rebooting constantly during Blaster and Sasser. Nice example! Want to know how many third-world countries have adopted OS X and Linux and rejected a crappy, horrible operating system that, when it's not crashing, is letting you get exploited on the net? Haha. You guys really are sheep who will accept anything. You actually think it's normal to require antivirus, antispyware, firewall, and so on software. Have fun paying out the ***. the rest of us will use an OS that's secure and functional from the start. Have fun waiting another two years to get something with crippled features from OS X Tiger of today. ROFLMAO

Here are some questions for Windows kidz to answer, but I know they won't because they can't admit it--they've put too much time and money into Windows crap to turn back now: Windows has you running in admin accounts. OS X doesn't. Windows writes into a "registry" that often gets corrupted. OS X has no registry. Windows leaves so many random ports open to the net that it had to ship with a default firewall. OS X doesn't have any ports open. Those 70 million users in India got to have their 70 million computers reboot constantly thanks to MS.Blaster. OS X did not. Windows has open platforms like ActiveX that allow websites to do almost anything they want, spreading worms and viruses like the plague. OS X does not. I could go on and on and on and on....... Clearly, I've proven that Microsoft's lack of security has more to do with its boneheaded design decisions. VBscript for e-mail messages? Come on! UNIX is the most-used and widely tested operating system in the world, and you don't see it rooted all the time. Instead, it just keeps chugging along, running most of the Internet. The army switched army.mil to OS X after it got hacked using Windows NT. They haven't been hacked since. Case closed. Windows is only good for videogames. That's it. It's just a console OS, and is being used for X-Box 360 (which is based on Apple hardware, LOL). You = owned.

Face it, Apple users haven't been attacked the way Windows user have. If they were the holes would show .. and I bet pretty darn fast too.

Why do Mac users post here? --- Gee.. it looks they're having fun.. count the HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHA's... Maybe Mac users come here to laugh?

3% market share.

"Gee.. it looks they're having fun.. count the HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHA's... Maybe Mac users come here to laugh?" If this is how Mac users have fun... I weep for them. What a pathetic life.

3% MARKET SHARE...

"Gee.. it looks they're having fun.. count the HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHA's... Maybe Mac users come here to laugh?" If this is how Mac users have fun... I weep for them. What a pathetic life.

"Math question: What's 15 x 0 ?" the chance of Mac taking over the market. the chance of Mac users developing a real sense of humor. the chance of Mac users getting out and having a life, instead of spending it bashing windows talkbacks. the chance of arrogant Mac a$$holes actually convincing anyone to switch with their bad fukkin attitudes. the chance of Mac Nazis actually developing a sense of humility and defeating their "superior race complexes".

"I hear it's all the rage in the PC world, and that all the Windows users have it." I hear that you are a naive idiot that knows nothing but Mac propaganda fed to you.

3% MARKET SHARE...

"Instead of responding to the Windows kidz who are in denial, I'll merely quote your hero Paul Thurrott: OS X is simply better than Windows. Especially for power users." So because you are either too stupid or lazy to put forth your own arguments, you will instead spend your pathetic life bashing Windows on a Windows site, copying the words of a man you hate. You, sir, are a fukking tool. And your hypocrisy knows no bounds.

"Math question: What's 15 x 0 ?" the chance of Mac taking over the market. the chance of Mac users developing a real sense of humor. the chance of Mac users getting out and having a life, instead of spending it bashing windows talkbacks. the chance of arrogant Mac a$$holes actually convincing anyone to switch with their bad fukkin attitudes. the chance of Mac Nazis actually developing a sense of humility and defeating their "superior race complexes".

"So far, no Windows user has addressed the registry, spyware, and other arguments that have been put forth." So what are your arguments? .NET programs don't use the registry. .NET came out in 2001. It takes awhile for things to change when you have the gargantuan market share that windows has. I know @apple would like to be in the same position. Spyware is a problem. You can never absolutely prevent a user from doing something if they don't know any better. Not even if they have to enter the admin password. This is a problem because there are a gazillion more users for windows.

Mac users are here because they have a jealous eye. And, of course, they're worried.

I understand that OS X is due for at least some Spyware. I'm sure it's gonna happen. But... this argument that OS X is a smaller market and therefore avoids attention has some flaws. We have viruses for cellphones and viruses for obscure routers. You'd think that by now we'd have some of this stuff for OSX. Also, by definition most mac users have more money to throw around thatn PC users (costs more, at least the high-end machines do). You'd think that people with a higher income would be like a juicy arm that the mosquito-like ***** who write virii and spyware would swoop to. There has to be some other X factor that's sheltered them this long. I suspect that it's much harder to get your spyware onto the machine. Apple bundles about 90% of what everyone wants, and the other 10% is well-established stuff. Also, Apple makes it easy to make lots of things. For example, screensavers that pan across pictures (a major source of spyware in the windows world, free screensaver!) are easy to customize and make on OS X.

you might wanna take a look what the CEO of Intel has to say about security: http://online.wsj.com/public/article/0,,SB111684809888140520-CB7pf4gh1ZaQ3oF44a0sjw8dJXY_20060524,00.html?mod=tff_main_tff_top

Let's see. Do I want a computer that quickly and easily plugs into my secure network, runs the software my users need and can be fixed in a jiffy if it goes wrong (let's be realistic, Windows PCs hardly ever go wrong if they're built and protected correctly)? Or do I want something that's practically alien to my corporate's Active Directory/Novell/UNIX network, only runs a handful of programs that don't really interact fully with anything else, are generally less intuitive, and if it breaks, you have to send the unit back to Apple to fix it for you. Oh, and it costs four times as much. Hmm. Tough call.

Oh, and it costs four times as much. --- If you keep lying to yourself you might actually believe it..

Funny, thing I never have to scrape off spyware in here and we have six computers running. But then install-on-demand is turned off in Internet Explorer etc. and there's no young kids installing every package offered. Hmmm Maybe it is not so much Windows security as users good sense? Hmm .. I wonder, could it be?

Quote: "Do you honestly think the @pple engineers know more about security then Microsoft engineers?" Yes, they do. OS X is designed on UNIX foundations, the most secure OS in the world. Why do you think the military switched army.mil from Windows NT to OS X after they got hacked? They obviously do not. It is 'nix that is secure then, not OS X. You just proved nothing. And let's face it, 'nix is not the most secure, either. You can hack a 'nix box too.

"Oh, and it costs four times as much. --- If you keep lying to yourself you might actually believe it.. " Hmmm.... Let's see... 1.8 Ghz iMAC G5 - £755 excl VAT. DELL Dimension 2400 - £221 INC VAT & Delivery. Once you've added the VAT, the MAC is roughly 4 times more expensive according to my calculator. http://www.planetaudiosystems.com/G5.htm http://www1.euro.dell.com/ Would you like some ketchup with those words, MAC droid?

The most bargain basement x86 computers here go for half the price of the least expensive Mac. And their harddrives are faster, their CPUs are speedier and the OS is priced lower .. and you can right-click out of the box. And Windows XP SP2 is one of the most war-hardened operating systems out there. It is secure if you want it to be. So, I agree Apples suck and their security is by obsurity - disasters waiting to happen - and they do no even have right-click .. And! .. It - is - the - menu - bar -every - single - time . Nope, no Macs for me thanks, I want Windows on X86/64 please.

CONVICTED MONOPOLIST

"Yes, there are security problems with windows, but no, you have to be a giant fucktard newbie to actually ever be affected by them." So, you really expect a normal user to: Check the Antivirus application. Check for Spyware. Implement intermediate mesures for holes that arent patched in months. Do regular updates of all the installed applications. Run everything as non admin and just toss those applications that came with the Camera/Camcorder/Mp3player etc out the windows and many games because they wont work as a restricted user. Manage the browser security zones and update all of them regularly. Dont surf on unsafe places, ie. dont use the internet at all. Youve got to be totally insane if you imagine even a normal admin doing this on every friggin computer on his net. Its not even possible with SUS or Zenworks so it will require quite a bit of handjobs. You do remember this OS is sold as userfriendly dont you? Its not like its some IKEA furniture.

Let's run it down: Macs kick Windows' butt in the security department. Zero viruses, trojans, and worms despite an install base of over 20 million people. No forced running in admin accounts like on Windows (snicker). Macs kick Windows' butt in the interface department. Research has shown that Mac users are more productive and faster than Windows users. Windows users are used to slowing their hand down to pinpoint floating menus, for instance. Mac users just jam the cursor to the top of the screen and click. Windows also requires on average at least three more clicks to accomplish what takes just one click on a Mac. Intel's own CEO recommends Macs, spending hours every weekend cleaning his daughter's Windows PC of crap. Paul Thurrott, owner of this website, said the following: "OS X is simply better than Windows. Especially for power users." He also took a Powerbook to WinHEC '05 and dominated his Internet-Nexus site with Tiger "Feature of the Day" articles. PCs require upgrading and fixing every six to twelve months, costing much more in the long run. Mac users keep their computers for much longer, which also creates a misleading market share number (market share is derived from annual sales, not install base). Benchmarks consistently show G5s eating x86 for breakfast. Microsoft even used them to demo their X-Box 360 this E3. That's right--even Microsoft is using Apple hardware for their own computing system. Windows slows down after about six months of use due to invalid registries. You have to either do a clean install to fix the problems or shell out for a "registry cleaner." OS X has no registry, as apps are self-contained bundles you can drag and drop to install and remove. If Windows ever does this, expect Windows kidz to glorify it as a "Microsoft innovation." OS X Tiger has every single feature Windows Longhorn is supposed to have two years from now. Have fun waiting and waiting... Wow, you guys really are gluttons for punishment!

"3% market share." 0 trojans, viruses, spyware, and a full featureset you have to wait two years for. 15% install base.

"So what are your arguments? .NET programs don't use the registry." Uh, yes they do. The registry isn't going anywhere. ".NET came out in 2001. It takes awhile for things to change when you have the gargantuan market share that windows has." Yeah, we've been waiting for Microsoft's crippled vaporware for years now. "Spyware is a problem." Not on Macs. "You can never absolutely prevent a user from doing something if they don't know any better. Not even if they have to enter the admin password. This is a problem because there are a gazillion more users for windows." No, it's a problem because Windows is boneheaded. ActiveX was a security hole waiting to happen. Safari has no little root-level application platforms like that to get exploited.

"Do I want a computer that quickly and easily plugs into my secure network, runs the software my users need and can be fixed in a jiffy if it goes wrong" That's what Macs are all about. "(let's be realistic, Windows PCs hardly ever go wrong if they're built and protected correctly)?" Haha. So you're saying the users have to build and protect it correctly, instead of the COMPUTER ALREADY BEING BUILT AND PROTECTED. Windows users have spent so much money and effort on fixing Windows, they've justified it in their minds. "Or do I want something that's practically alien to my corporate's Active Directory/Novell/UNIX network" OS X happily works with all three, and better than Windows itself does. Next. "only runs a handful of programs that don't really interact fully with anything else" Since you don't cite a single example of this mysterous handful of apps that don't interact with anything, you're clearly just making **** up. "are generally less intuitive" Another generality, and an amusing one considering Windows is WAY less intuitive than anything out there. Click Start to Shut Down, anyone? "and if it breaks, you have to send the unit back to Apple to fix it for you." As opposed to sending it to Dell, Compaq, and so on? "Oh, and it costs four times as much." No, it doesn't. Macs are as low as $499 now. Another Windows kid debunked. Have fun waiting another two years for the scaled-back Windows Longhorn. ROFL

"They obviously do not. It is 'nix that is secure then, not OS X. You just proved nothing." Uh, if 'nix is secure, and OS X is based on 'nix, than OS X is secure. HAHAHAHA...poor Windows kidz. "And let's face it, 'nix is not the most secure, either. You can hack a 'nix box too." Much more difficult than a Windows box. Heck, you can't even get spyware onto an OS X machine. There's just really no way to do it, or else it would have been done already especially with Apple in the news so much. You guys are in such denial, it's hysterical. Have fun on "Patch Tuesday" running your admin privileged accounts! lol

"1.8 Ghz iMAC G5 - £755 excl VAT. DELL Dimension 2400 - £221 INC VAT & Delivery. Once you've added the VAT, the MAC is roughly 4 times more expensive according to my calculator. Would you like some ketchup with those words, MAC droid?" Frst of all, it's Mac, not "MAC," dumbass. A MAC has to do with network cards. Second, your Dell Dimension 2400 has already been debunked by Mac World. All you did was pick the crappiest PC you could find that doesn't come with iLife (does your precious Dell come with its own movie and DVD creation software and its own music sequencer?), a CD burner, or anything else of value. It also has no Firewire port or DVI out, and there's a RAM upgrade limit. I could go on and on about its limitations. You just shot yourself in the foot! Lame! ROFL. Here you go, Windows kidz, read this and learn--it talks about how the Dell 2400 sucks *** compared to a tiny Mac mini: www.macworld.com/weblogs/editors/ 2005/01/miniapplesandoranges/index.php Your arguments have already been completely debunked. Macs are actually cheaper than PCs, and they also last longer so you're not upgrading them every six months like you are with PCs. Don't you guys get tired of being suckered out of your money all the time? Mac users pay less! Poor, masochistic Windows kidz. Part of a brainwashed flock of high school gamerz.

"The most bargain basement x86 computers here go for half the price of the least expensive Mac." And they suck *** in comparison. RAM upgrade limitations, no Firewire, no iLife software suite of free DVD creation/movie editing/photo storage/music storage software. No need for anti-virus, anti-spyware, and firewall software. "And their harddrives are faster" Macs and PCs use the same hard drive. "their CPUs are speedier" RISC chips like the PowerPC execute more instructions per clock cycle. Those cheap PCs you're talking about have extremely low bus speeds, crippling the CPU. This is why Windows defenders are so retarded. They think CPU speed matters and ignore the bus speed, cache, and all the other factors that cripple your cheap $299 computer. "and the OS is priced lower" Windows XP Professional costs $30 more than OS X. ".. and you can right-click out of the box." You can right-click out of the box in OS X too. I'm using a five-button mouse on my Powerbook. "And Windows XP SP2 is one of the most war-hardened operating systems out there. It is secure if you want it to be." UNIX is older and way more war-hardened than Windows. We hear all about how "secure" Windows is every month when a new worm or trojan is announced. Did you have fun when your computer was rebooting last year thanks to MS.Blaster? "So, I agree Apples suck and their security is by obsurity" No, it's not. Already been disproven, debunked, and laughed at. Why do you think the army switched army.mil to OS X after getting hacked using Windows NT? None of you Windows kidz have responded to this. "and they do no even have right-click" God, Windows users are idiots. Macs have had right click since the mid-90s, just like Windows. I love how stupid Windows users make themselves appear. ".. And! .. It - is - the - menu - bar -every - single - time ." no - it - is - not "Nope, no Macs for me thanks, I want Windows on X86/64 please." Have fun with hyperthreading exploits! LOL

Why are these Mac Morons wasting their time on a site devoted to Windows information? Surely, if the world hasn't got the message by now that if you want something cute, you buy Apple design, they never will. Twenty one years of Mac users scratching themselves and the itch still won't go away...

Haha, did someone really compare the Dell 2400 to the Mac mini? That's already been debunked: www.macworld.com/weblogs/editors/ 2005/01/miniapplesandoranges/index.php Next!

"Why are these Mac Morons wasting their time on a site devoted to Windows information?" Shouldn't you be off spending $250 on anti-spyware, anti-virus, and firewall software? LOL. "Surely, if the world hasn't got the message by now that if you want something cute, you buy Apple design, they never will." But the world HAS gotten the message. Analysts predict a doubling of Apple's marketshare this year, and a tripling for next year. And Microsoft's Office and Windows revenues are way down, failing to meet their projections. "Twenty one years of Mac users scratching themselves and the itch still won't go away..." Windows is dying. It's sad to see you in denial--not only defending a convicted monopolist who destroyed a better OS (OS/2), but subjecting yourself to Windows crap that can't network smoothly, requires endless cleaning and babysitting to run, and actually has a "Patch Tuesday" because it needs updating so much. Sad. Have fun waiting another two years using Windows XP, only to have to pay $1500 to buy a 3ghz PC just to display windows on the screen in Longhorn. Microsoft does that on purpose to force you to buy hardware from their OEMs. I guess you're quite happy being a little sheep, avoiding the superior technical solution. Hell, you guys dont' even have a functioning sleep mode. Lol. Mac users never even turn their computers off; they take it for granted that they never need to. God, PCs suck. Even Microsoft switched to Apple hardware for the X-Box 360. Shouldn't that tell you something?

www.macworld.com/weblogs/editors/ 2005/01/miniapplesandoranges/index.php Next!

"Surely, if the world hasn't got the message by now that if you want something cute, you buy Apple design, they never will." Who has 85+% of the music player market again? Whose market share is tripling by 2007? Whose in the news for not forcing users to spend $300 on anti-virus, anti-spyware, registry cleaners, and firewalls? Windows is NOT user friendly. You have to buy a bunch of third-party crap just to keep it running securely. That's embarrassing, and I'm shocked you defend it.

"Haha, did someone really compare the Dell 2400 to the Mac mini? That's already been debunked: www.macworld.com/weblogs/editors/ 2005/01/miniapplesandoranges/index.php Next! " Ha ha! Did a MAC user (hope this *******them off again!!) really think that anyone who knows about computers would waste time on a MAC site??

>>> "Math question: What's 15 x 0 ?" the number of people who use macs?" >>> No, the number of intelligent people that use Windows (or any Microsoft product)

"You can right-click out of the box in OS X too." So Macs come out of the box with mice having more than one "button"?

"Have fun with hyperthreading exploits!" Ah, you clueless little troll. First of all, AMD64 procs have no Hyperthreading. Second, Hyperthreading can be disabled on Intel procs. Third, HT will be largely irrelevant in the rapidly approaching world of x86-64 dual core processors. Notice that Intel's mainstream dual core procs don't even include HT anymore.

"No, the number of intelligent people that use Windows (or any Microsoft product)" Wow, what a comeback. Sad that you couldn't do better, ya pathetic little troll.

"Whose in the news for not forcing users to spend $300 on anti-virus, anti-spyware, registry cleaners, and firewalls?" Nice attempt at misinformation, you pathetic little troll. If you spend that much on those items, you are stupid. And there are free versions of all of those products. You really don't have a clue do you fukkwad?

"Whose market share is tripling by 2007?" It's easy to triple such a small amount. And that's not even guaranteed.

"Math question: What's 15 x 0 ?" the chance of Mac taking over the market. the chance of Mac users developing a real sense of humor. the chance of Mac users getting out and having a life, instead of spending it bashing windows talkbacks. the chance of arrogant Mac a$$holes actually convincing anyone to switch with their bad fukkin attitudes. the chance of Mac Nazis actually developing a sense of humility and defeating their "superior race complexes".

"All you did was pick the crappiest PC you could find that doesn't come with iLife (does your precious Dell come with its own movie and DVD creation software and its own music sequencer?), a CD burner, or anything else of value. It also has no Firewire port or DVI out, and there's a RAM upgrade limit. I could go on and on about its limitations. You just shot yourself in the foot!" So iLife is a business application then. Is that what you are saying? Most major businesses would benefit from having iLife bundled? And CD and DVD burners, those are needed for business desktops. Especially in call centers and the like right? Is that what you are saying? That businesses would benefit from paying extra for the bundled burner? "Macs are actually cheaper than PCs, and they also last longer so you're not upgrading them every six months like you are with PCs. Don't you guys get tired of being suckered out of your money all the time? Mac users pay less!" So businesses upgrade their PCs every six months, is that what you are saying? You stupid, naive, pathetic, little troll. It's sad that you are such a zealot that all you can do is mindlessly spew propaganda without thinking about the facts. How fukking depressing.

"Microsoft: SP2 Makes XP 15 Times More Secure... ....than an open door in an apartment in South Central Los Angeles."

I would just like to shine this one in the spotlight again: "Whose in the news for not forcing users to spend $300 on anti-virus, anti-spyware, registry cleaners, and firewalls?" HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA! Fukking Mac trolls are so stupid. It is so sad how reliant you are on propaganda and plain old bullsh1t. Yes, you muthafukka's are dumb!

No-one is "forced" to spend money on anything - ever hear of Linux?

Many of you are missing the plain and simple truth, iterated time and again over the decades: Macs suck. They sucked in 1980. They sucked in 1985. They sucked in 1990. They sucked in 1995. They really sucked in the the year 2000. Any they suck now, in the year 2005. Macs sucked then, they suck now, and they will suck in the future. Macs suck.

God I hate this site now. I used to read it regularly. Why does everything turn into a "Mac" debate? I use Windows. I LIKE Windows. I have no spyware. I have no viruses. I have games. I am a professional programmer. I am a professional designer. I work (very very long hours) on two flawless XP based desktops, one at home and one at work. To call me a "sucker" because I made a choice that can be validated by simple discussion. So Windows has a "registry". So what? Do you think it upsets me that my operating system uses something called a "registry"? What do I care? I never touch it. It just works. Let me set one thing straight: Windows is an entirely reasonable choice for many users, home or professional, with many positives and many negatives. Security can be an issue, but with regular AUTOMATIC maintenence is no longer a problem. Viruses, malware, etc, are more often a product of poor education than operating system, something exacerbated by certain microsoft interface decisions (too little transparency of what exact programs are starting up, for example). To bag out Windows in such a foolish way only makes you look like an idiot. There are good things about Windows, there are good things about OSX. There are bad things about both. Personally, for me there has never been and probably will never be a compelling reason to go to an operating system with less software support, expensive and non user-maintainable hardware and some of THE most annoying fans in the world. That was a CHOICE I made, and I stand by it. Back off, for christ sake. Oh, and I'll stand by my decision. If you want to flame me, or just debate: matt@australiangamer.com

Oh, and for the record, the PC fanboys here don't seem to be much better. Just a point. matt@australiangamer.com

PC "fanboys" hanging out at Windowsitpro.com doesn't seem as bad as Mac users hanging out here, in their boredom, trolling the site. I could be wrong, but doesn't it seem odd that there seems to be more Mac users posting [their anti-Windows drivel] that there are Windows users posting? What's wrong with the Mac and its OS that they aren't participating at the Mac sites? Could it be that the cheap Macs use old hardware? That the expensive Macs have a bore-you-to-tears butt ugly useless conglomeration of eye-candy based on unoriginal copied code from the UNIX commnnity? Code so old it can run 1960's clunkers? But hey, most Macs aren't that fast anyway so it probably doesn't matter!! Geesh, Apple user, get a life! Go off to your Apple websites and participate there. Isn't your OS interesting enough? Guess not.

SP2 SUXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX

Dude! Something is totally wrong here! All this talk about spyware is making me nervous. I have searched desperately to find this sort of thing on my iMac, although I have had no success! How else am I supposed to destroy it if it's not on my computer?!? Oh, duh... so SP2 = 15 times more secure than crap while OS X 10.4 = 100% secure and 100% unlike Windows Is there supposed to be some sort of dispute here? Or am I missing something the same way my computer's missing viruses, spyware, adware, Windows...

If SP2 is so secure then why does it still need Anti-Virus software?

SP2 still needs anti-virus and anti-spyware software because it's not secure, I believe that's the part Jason Garms forgot to mention. Although, he did mention that SP2 **strongly recommends that the user enable Auto Update by default.** Doesn't sound like SP2 is very secure to me if it "strongly recommends" that you auto update with Microsoft's security packets.

you know in the end any os can be just as secure as the other. and like it or not to be really secure requires actually working with the os after you take it out of the box and install it. Windows can be just as strong as macs and a mac could be just as weak as a windows box. in the end i'm with mac for the pure reason that they tend to be more original in there ideas versus microsoft who steals all there ideas and are a bunch of money hungry thieves. plus i use linux and macs os x is a bsd based os so its very smiliar to linux.

Watch Pirates of Silicon Valley and see if you don't think Apple doesn't steal its ideas. Apple's GUI is direct from what they were able to nab at Xerox’s Paulo Alto Research Centre. Apple user, remove the clear polymer halo, take off utlra-white plastic wings and wipe that holier-than-thou look off your faces because your adored graphical user interface was taken from Xerox. When Apple says "Think Different", do they mean "think thievery"?

"Watch Pirates of Silicon Valley and see if you don't think Apple doesn't steal its ideas." Oh yes. I get all my history from movies. These fictionalized accounts of real events keep me from learning actual facts. That's like watching "Amadeus" and expecting a true account of Mozart's life. Educate yourself. Then come back here and give an informed opinion, OK?

first of all i never said they didnt steal i said there ideas are more orginal the reality is that yes xerox created the gui but both microsoft and mac have stolen the idea. along with thousands of others, hence the reason i try to stick with linux at least if they use an idea generally there not making profit on it. notice i said generally anothers words more often then not however they may in some instances, where as microsoft looks to claim total credit, patent it, and make every penny possible. perhaps mac does this as well but i dont see it nearly as much

Personally, I think Microsoft now needs a performance reset. As I have said in some of my previous posts, I think software in general, and Microsoft software in particular, is getting slower at faster rate than hardware is getting faster. And this problem acutely affects Vista. I think Microsoft needs... (Pingback) http://dataland.wordpress.com/2007/11/28/performance-reset/